females first

Reasons for Veganism

I'm assuming that at least some of the vegans in this community prefer that their friends and/or significant others practice veganism.

If you are a vegan for moral reasons (even if that's only one of your reasons), would it matter at all to you if a new person in your life was vegan, but not for any moral reasons whatsoever? If you were attracted to someone in part because that person was a vegan, would that specific attraction be affected at all, even a little, if you found out there was no moral motivation?

interview with animal trainer (x-posted)

hi, im preparing to do an interview with an animal trainer and i wanted to see if there were any questions that you would be particularly interested in asking? (i will be happy to post the audio clip when its done). here is some background information on the guest:

-26 yr old female with BA in zoology
-huge animal lover, her favorites being birds of prey.
-past work includes volunteering at a zoo and a birds of prey rescue center for a number of years
-currently works as a trainer for a birds of prey center. they put on live shows with the birds for educational purposes

we are going to be talking about the animal welfare aspect of training animals in general, and comparing/contrasting that with the training that goes on at her job.

i can provide more info if this is too vague.. hope to hear from some people, should be a good interview! thx :D

To stay vegan or not?

I've been a vegan for four years. I'm a pretty good cook and like spending time in the kitchen. I try to eat a wide variety of food, although I often wind up resorting to carbs. As a whole, it's been a pretty good experience.

However, converting to veganism wasn't really my choice. My ex, who was both physically and emotionally abusive, made the choice for the both of us. Now that I've left her and am moving into my own apartment, I'm wondering if I want to stay vegan. After eating raw for a couple months, I have discovered that eating gluten and soy seem to greatly affect me, and my vegan options seem much more limited as a result. I also do not subscribe to vegan dogma. I do not believe that nature is inherently kind or harmonious at all, and I don't think it's inherently wrong to eat meat. I would, however, choose more humane options: grass-fed, free range, cage-free etc. I would add meat and possibly eggs, but probably not dairy, back into my diet on occasion.

On the side of staying vegan, it's cheaper (I'm a grad student) and probably an overall healthier diet. I have naturally high cholesterol, and eating meat/eggs would probably exacerbate that. I know how to cook vegan (although not soy/gluten free), but have no idea how to even begin preparing meat. My family has finally accepted that this is the way I eat. And this is vain, but I'm afraid that I'd gain weight if I wasn't vegan. Plus, I'm not entirely sure I could do it. I was vegetarian before I was vegan, and it's been a long, long time since I've eaten meat.

So strong arguments for or against? Any additional points to consider? Any ex-vegan experiences to share?

(no subject)

What kind of food did you grow up eating?

EDIT: This surprises me. I thought this would draw out the less active members. Doesn't anyone else think this area is more significant than it receives credit for? Especially in a food/culture/ethics community?

Sneaking vegan versions of food to omnivores

Okay, so I have made plenty of vegan recipes for things like brownies or pancakes and served them to my family. My mom is relatively open-minded, and she tries to be objective. She usually tells me that they taste just as good as a regular brownie would taste. Yet, when she makes the brownies, she still uses eggs. Why does she do that when she knows vegan ones are just as good? It's not even more work or more money to make them my way! I've proven this to her.

On a related note, my dad is not open-minded. If he knows that something is vegan, he won't touch it, assuming that it must be terrible without those lucullan, ambrosial dairy by-products, as if that's what makes the food good. And my dad isn't even big on dairy products in the first place!

Anyway, Thanksgiving is coming up, and I said I'd eat the turkey if my mom bought a free range one that I approved before purchase. My dad then said that we'd have to buy two turkeys if we did that, assuming that the unnatural hormones and such are what make his meat taste good. Well, he's wrong. I know hunters that say that the meat they personally kill tastes a million times better than anything you could buy at a store, and it's no wonder why. That is natural meat.

So, here's an ethical question, and if it's inappropriate for this community, I apologize, and please just refer me to a more felicitous one.

Would it be wrong to volunteer to prepare the whole Thanksgiving meal, and make as many as possible things vegan versions and use a free range turkey and withhold the fact that I've prepared the foods this way until after they eat them? Or is that dishonest and .... demagogic? I feel kind of like a cozener, like trying to trick people so that I can impose my beliefs on them. However, it probably won't make a difference anyway. They'll admit that the vegan foods are just as good and then go right on making their foods with eggs and shit, like my mom. So ... my cause is better off by tricking them just because fewer eggs and junk will be used for the meal. Right? Or what?

X-posted: freegans, cheapvegan, vegandebate, vegancooking, vegan_debate


There have been a couple of posts on veganpeople and veganism that have asked to help determine if certain situations can be morally acceptable despite not being strictly vegan - "is it ethical if I use these abandoned eggs from my rescued hen/drink this milk from a friend's pet cow/if people use seeing-eye dogs?"

For many vegans, the answer is no, no use of an animal is ethical - without a way to determine an animal's consent, we have no way of knowing if they are truly comfortable with the use of their products or services, and to continue to use them to our benefit is exploitation.

"Exploitation" and "consent" are keystones in the moral arguments against omnivorism. However, the same people who think it's arguable that consent is indeterminable in non-human animals also argue that animals are undeniably thinking, emotionally expressive beings capable of communicating things such as happiness, sadness, pain, grief, playfulness, love, and even some degree of spirituality.

How can consent be indeterminable if animals are also seen as self-aware, emotionally expressive beings?

Vegans shouldn't have sex with meat eaters?

There's a group in New Zealand vegans shunning vegans who have relations with meat eaters.

Do you think this is taking Veganism to an extreme?

I think it does. You can't be 100% vegan. It's only something you try to achieve, but so many everyday products we use are not vegan. I'm sure we're familiar with cars and junk.

But to ban sex with someone? Or having a relationship? That's just sick. I'm a vegan who happens to like a meat eater. Do you think I care about the fact she eats meat? No. I don't.

The point is, that shouldn't be a factor in a relationship.

What do you think about this?

(no subject)


I have a question...i think.

Anyhoo, I've been sick for months. They think its my gallbladder! >_<

The Dr.s are saying NO NUTS or BEANS!!!!

so think about that
no beans....of anykind....no kidney, navy, pinto, black, chick, SOY...no lentles...
no nuts....no almonds, walnuts, peanuts (OR PENUT BUTTER!), no pecans...

so if i cant have soy beans...doesnt that mean i cant have tofu? 
or...chick peas...so then i cant have HUMMUS??(which i eat...ALL THE TIME!)

Im freakin! so i think soy milk...since its not whole beans...and tofu might be ok right?

but im worried....so i cant eat ANYTHING anymore...anyting totally VEGAN
i mean, i am lactose intolerant so...theres that but...
i may have to start eating...DUN DUN DUN FISH??? or something...
i cant drop dead becasue all my staples are making me sick.....


oh help?!

xposted for major help sorry!
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why or why not?

Should public universities be required to have vegetarian/vegan dorms/dining halls and in the same vein should they be required to have Kosher or (forgive my ignorance of what the word is called but) Islamic-diet adhering dining halls, etc?